Episode 109

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Published on:

6th Jun 2025

Episode 109 (Season 2): The Power of Play: Holding the Heavy with Laughter and Connection

Finding joy and playfulness can feel complicated when the world feels heavy and overwhelming. For neurodivergent people, accessing moments of laughter and lightness—especially while navigating guilt or social pressure to be productive—becomes an essential, yet nuanced, form of self-preservation and resistance.

In this episode, Patrick Casale and Dr. Megan Anna Neff, two AuDHD mental health professionals, discuss the vital importance of play, laughter, and connection for neurodivergent well-being. They candidly discuss their personal struggles and breakthroughs with accessing joy, examine the intersection of play with heavy emotions, and share how dark humor, rituals, and community banter can help neurodivergent people process pain, release shame, and hold complexity. From the guilt often tied to playfulness during difficult times to the healing power of connection and humor, Patrick and Megan Anna offer both real talk and creative strategies for bringing more lightness into your everyday life.

Top 3 reasons to listen to the entire episode:

  1. Discover accessible ways to bring more laughter and play into your day, even if you struggle with traditional hobbies or feel weighed down by the world’s pain.
  2. Gain insight into the intersection of play, cultural resistance, and advocacy, with reflections on how joy can be both a survival tool and a form of empowerment for marginalized communities.
  3. Hear honest, relatable stories from Patrick and Megan Anna about dealing with shame, executive dysfunction, and neurodivergent awkwardness—and learn how humor can be a bridge for connection and healing.

If you’ve ever felt guilty about seeking joy or struggled to figure out how to let playfulness back in, this episode will encourage you to embrace laughter and lightness as essential parts of the neurodivergent experience. Explore what it means to hold the heavy while still making room for play.

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Thanks to Our Sponsor: Jane

✨ Jane:

Jane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: jane.app/mentalhealth-us

✨ The Autistic Burnout Workbook:

I'm Dr. Megan Anna Neff, owner of Neurodivergent Insights, and I'm excited to announce the release of my book, The Autistic Burnout Workbook. I'm running a special deal for those who support my work. After you order, you will get a coupon code that you can use toward our store for the same amount. For example, the workbook costs $18.99, so after purchase, you'd get a credit of $18.99 to use in our digital shop or in our Etsy shop, which gets you another digital workbook of your choosing for free. This is technically a pre-order promotion that was originally set to end on March 10th, but for listeners of the podcast, I'm going to extend this deal, so if you buy the book in the next month, you can also redeem this special. Thank you for supporting my work. It means so much to me and I hope that you will find this a helpful resource for you as you continue to build a life that is a bit more resilient to autistic burnout.

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💬 Join Divergent Conversations Underground

Divergent Conversations Underground is a space for messy conversations, real connection, and unfinished thoughts in a neurodivergent-affirming community. If you’d like to go deeper with us into more nuanced, searching conversations, join here: divergentconversations.substack.com

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Mentioned in this episode:

Jane

Jane is a clinic management software and EMR designed to be an extra set of helping hands in your health and wellness business. Available online and on any device, Jane has branded online booking, scheduling, insurance billing, customizable documentation templates and online forms, integrated payments, telehealth, and more — wrapped up in one beautiful package that even your patients/clients will love. Backed by our unlimited human support available by phone, email, and chat (even on Saturdays!), Jane is here to help you get back to the work you love. Get 2 months off new Jane subscriptions when you use code DCPOD at signup. Visit: https://jane.app/mentalhealth-us

The Autistic Burnout Workbook

I'm Dr. Megan Anna Neff, owner of Neurodivergent Insights, and I'm excited to announce the release of my book, The Autistic Burnout Workbook. I'm running a special deal for those who support my work. After you order, you will get a coupon code that you can use toward our store for the same amount. For example, the workbook costs $18.99, so after purchase, you'd get a credit of $18.99 to use in our digital shop or in our Etsy shop, which gets you another digital workbook of your choosing for free. This is technically a pre-order promotion that was originally set to end on March 10th, but for listeners of the podcast, I'm going to extend this deal, so if you buy the book in the next month, you can also redeem this special. Thank you for supporting my work. It means so much to me and I hope that you will find this a helpful resource for you as you continue to build a life that is a bit more resilient to autistic burnout. Use the following link to grab this offer: https://neurodivergentinsights.notion.site/17ea17a4bb8b8034ab2bf9b03c560a64 After this deal ends, you can use this link to purchase this workbook: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/The-Autistic-Burnout-Workbook/Megan-Anna-Neff/9781507223062

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About the Podcast

Divergent Conversations
Reflections of Two Neurodivergent Clinicians
Dr. Megan Neff and Patrick Casale are two Neurodivergent therapists in a neurotypical world. During this podcast, they’ll talk about their own personal experiences as Autistic-ADHDers. They will reflect on their lived experience as AuDHD mental health professionals, and entrepreneurs, as well as offer clinical guidance, and support. Episodes will be conversational in nature, and they’ll interview other ND Folx to amplify the voices of other neurodivergent advocates and individuals as they share their authentic stories. New episodes will come out weekly, on all major platforms. Megan told Patrick, ”I’ll bring the chaos, You organize it.” This perfectly sums up their working relationship and friendship. Reflections of two neurodivergent clinicians. Raw, Vulnerable, Affirmative As Hell. Follow on instagram.com/divergentconversations
Topics include Autism, ADHD, Sleep struggles, Chronic Illness, RSD, Alexithymia, Autistic burnout, Intersectionality, Neuroqueer, Creativity, OCD, Neurodivergence, Affirming Language, Small business ownership, Unpacking Internalized Ableism, and so much more.
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Legal Disclaimer: The content provided in this podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. Always consult a qualified healthcare provider or medical professional for personalized advice regarding any medical condition or treatment.